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John Kerry speaking in Capitol rotunda.
Our new secretary of state?
The New York Times reports:
President Obama plans to nominate Senator John Kerry of Massachusetts as secretary of state, a senior administration official said, succeeding Hillary Rodham Clinton and putting in place the first member of his second-term national security team. [...]

The decision by Mr. Obama, expected to be announced early Friday afternoon, comes at a time when Mrs. Clinton has been recovering from a concussion suffered earlier this month. Mrs. Clinton, who has long said she would leave the post after Mr. Obama’s first term, is not expected to attend the announcement.

On Thursday, David Nir wrote about two new polls of potential candidates in a then-hypothetical special election to replace John Kerry in the Senate. It's no longer hypothetical, but as David explained:
What this all says to me is that the picture is far too unsettled for anyone to get a good handle on it—and if anyone does say with certainty that they can predict the future here, well, I'd just like to know if Amazon Prime carries the same model of crystal ball that they're using.
Stay tuned.

Originally posted to Daily Kos on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:31 AM PST.

Also republished by Daily Kos Elections.

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Comment Preferences

  •  I think he will be a fine Sec of State. (29+ / 0-)

    Hopefully we can keep the Mass senate seat.

    Join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news and views written from a black pov—everyone is welcome.

    by TomP on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:33:21 AM PST

    •  I think we will keep the seat. I know many here (11+ / 0-)

      think someone how Brown is unbeatable candidate, hello he just lost to a novice in politics being the only incumbent this cycle to lose his reelection.

      As for the new poll, how many polls showed him beating Warren in 2012, and how many polls showed Martha Coakley beating him in 2010?

      "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

      by LaurenMonica on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:36:42 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Agree. (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      TomP, abgin, gosoxataboy

      He's a star, which is unusual for a second term appointment.

      Usually, in a second term, they start giving lower profile candidates the jobs because they no longer need an "all star" pick.

      I suppose Rice would have been that lower profile pick.

      So, maybe, this will turn out for the best.

      "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

      by Bush Bites on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:03:03 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Star? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        drsampson

        Could have fooled me.

        •  Of course. (5+ / 0-)

          Former presidential candidate, current chair of the foreign relations committee.

          He's not some career bureaucrat nobody ever heard of.

          "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

          by Bush Bites on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:19:17 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Yeah... (0+ / 0-)

            he is a real Michael Dukakis...(who I actually have a great respect for.)  Kerry ran an unforgivably incompetent campaign.

            and Jesse Helms was chair of the Foreign Relations committee.

            We would probably do better with a lackluster bureaucrat..who wasn't shopping for a cabinet position, any cabinet position.

            Lackluster bureaucrats with diplomatic competence make excellent secretaries of state.  

            •  Look at the polling numbers below. (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              JBraden, askew

              And get over 2004.

              Kerry's big mistake was selecting John Edwards as veep, which you probably agreed with.

              "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

              by Bush Bites on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:34:07 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

            •  The hell he did (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              NYFM, Zack from the SFV

              Kerry was the only Dem nominee to outperform his national average in the tipping point state (OH).  Which means he at least ran a better focused campaign than other nominees.

              None of Kerry's slip-ups (voted for before against, etc.) were all that substantive.  Certainly none came close to the 47% remark or picking Snow Snookie as a running mate. It's easy to portray any Senator as a flip-flopper.

              Bush was running as a wartime incumbant and shamelessly using every executive lever to assist his campaign (bogus terror alerts, steel tarifffs, etc.)  Kerry's only opportunities to take on Bush directly were the debates, and he wiped the floor with him.

              That being said, I agree Obama shouldn't nominate Kerry because keeping the seat is too important.  Obama didn't just foist Jan Brewer on us ahead of schedule.  He scuttled any chance at winning a seat in Kansas by nominating Sebelius to HHS.  He also nearly lost us a seat in Colorado by whisking away Salazar.

              •  Brewer wasn't even ahead of schedule (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Zack from the SFV

                She was profoundly unpopular among Republicans.  There is no way Brewer won her party's nomination in 2010 had Napolitano served out her full term.  Brewer's election was due to one thing: her signing of SB1070, which made her an absolute hero among Republicans.

                To believe that markets determine value is to believe that milk comes from plastic bottles. Bromley (1985)

                by sneakers563 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 02:46:11 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

        •  Yes star. Head of the SFRC former presidential (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          elmo, MPociask, Bush Bites, gosoxataboy

          candidate.  Other than Clinton there is no one with as much stature in the Democratic party.  

        •  But don't take my word for it. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          faolan

          From 2004:

          Global Poll Shows a Kerry Landslide
          Poll finds him preferred around world
          by Thomas Crampton

          PARIS -- If the world could cast a vote in the United States presidential election, John Kerry would beat George W. Bush by a landslide, according to a poll released on Wednesday that is described as the largest sample of global opinion on the race.

          "It is absolutely clear that John Kerry would win handily if the people of the world could vote," said Steve Kull, director of The Program on International Policy Attitudes of the University of Maryland, a co-sponsor of the survey. "It is rather striking that just one in five people surveyed around the world support the re-election of President Bush."

          http://www.commondreams.org/...

          From this week:

          47 minutes ago
          CNN Poll: Majority say Kerry pick for secretary of state good for country
          mug.steinhauser
          Posted by
          CNN Political Editor Paul Steinhauser   

          Washington (CNN) – A majority of Americans give a thumbs up to Sen. John Kerry becoming the country's next secretary of state, according to a new national survey.

          A CNN/ORC International poll released Friday indicates that 57% of the public says it would be good for the country if the senior senator from Massachusetts becomes America's top diplomat, with 32% saying it would be bad for the nation.

          http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/...

          "Michael Moore, who was filming a movie about corporate welfare called 'Capitalism: A Love Story,' sought and received incentives."

          by Bush Bites on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:27:27 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

        •  He was a losing candidate for the Dems in 2004 (0+ / 0-)

          That's why he has high name recognition.

    •  Well, (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Bush Bites, cactusgal, KingofSpades

      this ain't gonna help Brown much with GOP voters.

      Après le thé, le déluge. -- Glenn Beck, aka Napoleon XIV

      by mspicata on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:03:34 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  They need to change it so that (0+ / 0-)

      the special coincides with the midterm elections.  It's better for Dems that way and is cheaper for the state too.

      Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

      by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:48:14 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  I think John Kerry would make a great SoS (21+ / 0-)

    And if he hadn't given unknown Barack Obama a national platform at his 2004 Convention, there would be no President Barack Obama.

    "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

    by LaurenMonica on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:33:55 AM PST

  •  John Kerry will be a good sec of state (14+ / 0-)

    Congrats to him. I am happy for him.

    Follow PA Keystone Liberals on Twitter: @KeystoneLibs

    by wishingwell on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:34:17 AM PST

  •  I fell asleep just thinking about it. (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Team Slacker

    I'm sure he'll do fine....at boring the world to death.

    "The next time everyone will pay for it equally, and there won't be any more Chosen Nations, or any Others. Poor bastards all." ~The Boomer Bible

    by just another vet on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:35:29 AM PST

  •  Why do I feel like he was already nominated by (5+ / 0-)

    John McCain, Lindsay Graham, and Susan Collins.  The President's announcement is just an after thought.

    "Democracy is a life; and involves continual struggle." ---'Fighting Bob' LaFollette

    by leftreborn on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:35:39 AM PST

  •  I don't begrudge Kerry (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    just another vet

    I like him and I thought he got totally shafted in 04 by a guy who hid out in the Texas National Guard to avoid Vietnam (I have no problem with National Guardsmen but lets get real- MANY twentysomething men of that era who didn't have well-connected daddies would have given their left nut to be in the Guard instead of a rice paddy or on the run in Canada). I just wish that a career diplomat with an understanding of economics and cultures have been chosen. Instead of having a small group of aristocrats running things maybe we can try people who were, you know, trained for this stuff?

  •  Merry Christmas, Scott Brown. (5+ / 0-)

    You get to play in the sandbox again -- and we get to beat you twice in a year's time.

    Après le thé, le déluge. -- Glenn Beck, aka Napoleon XIV

    by mspicata on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:36:15 AM PST

  •  It look like Chuck Hagel Secretary of Defense (0+ / 0-)

    Hopes of becoming Secretary of  Defense are deemed by some remarks of his on gays

  •  Kerry will be a fantastic SOS (15+ / 0-)

    I think we are losing focus here -

    Who is the most qualified Democrat (actually, person in general) to be SOS?

    John Kerry

    Out of all of his potential picks, who would make the best SOS?

    John Kerry

    Out of all of his potential picks, who has the highest status with foreign leaders?

    John Kerry (Joe Biden too, but he already has a job)

    Let's keep our eyes on the  prize - which is governing effectively.  

    Is MA Dems can't hold a Senate seat, that's more their problem than Obama's.

    And I have a feeling they will pull out all the stops this time.

    The object of persecution is persecution. The object of torture is torture. The object of power is power. --George Orwell

    by jgkojak on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:40:23 AM PST

  •  What a disaster! (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paleo, fenway49, aseth

    Special election in Massachusetts where the Koch borthers and others will poor in millions of dollars to basically have a redo on the 2012 election.  If Brown wins then that is it for Obama's second term.  

    And Kerry - he gave a good speech at the Convention, he is an honorable and decent man who served his country in war and as a public servant.  But face it he is a blow hard who comes to State with a lot of baggage and who may not be up to dealing with the challenges that truly face us.

    Mr. President - why do you hobble yourself.  You did in 2009 taking leaders from states and the Senate in order to staff your Cabinet.  There are lots of people who can staff a Cabinet so why cripple yourself doing so?

    •  BRown can be defeated,and Kerry is a great choice (8+ / 0-)

      so I humbly disagree

      Follow PA Keystone Liberals on Twitter: @KeystoneLibs

      by wishingwell on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:44:41 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  What happens if Brown wins? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        aseth

        Even so the especial election will consume a huge amount of the oxygen in our national conversation and distract from doing anything.  Paralysis as we wait for the voters of Massachusetts to decide.  And remember it is a blue state so there is not a big OFA operation.  Whose voters will come out?  What faux outrage will become a deciding factor in this election?  Sorry but John Kerry ain't and will never be General Marshall.

      •  Brown CAN be defeated (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        docmidwest

        Far from a guarantee. And a needless risk. Senate seats are important. Dems only have a few votes to spare for majority support on bills and still have Conservadems to worry about. A Brown win gets the GOP that much closer to taking the Senate in 2014, when a lot of vulnerable Democrats are up.

        I notice a lot of the people so sure Brown can be beaten DO NOT LIVE in Massachusetts and don't work on campaigns here.

        Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

        by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:26:44 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  You don't think Hillary (5+ / 0-)

      came with baggage -- including the concern that she wasn't up to it?  As for hobbling himself: Obama gets a trusted SoS, and even if we lose the Senate seat, we still have a majority there, and the winner in Mass will be on a short leash with the voters.

      Après le thé, le déluge. -- Glenn Beck, aka Napoleon XIV

      by mspicata on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:45:26 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Hillary was not a Senator or Governor (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        The Nose, fenway49

        It is a nationalized special election that is the problem.  If there was a giant among Democrats or public officials in Massachusetts then no problem.  There is not.  Adelson spent $155 million in 2012 and the Koch spent lots with their buddies - so what will $50-$100 million in Massachusetts do to an election when the other side knows damn well that the process and the outcome will be the tail wagging the dog.

    •  We can't think like that (6+ / 0-)

      Look at this thread! So far we've got one person arguing against "aristocracy" in high positions, and then we've got other people saying "keep him in the Senate" ARGH!

      Change is a part of life and politics!

      We will always need to locate, identify and recruit strong candidates for the House, Senate, cabinets and White House.

      Anything can happen to anyone at anytime. Paul Wellstone died in a crash. Inouye just died. Lautenberg is friggin' 88 years old. (Hi Cory Booker!)

      No I don't like Scott Brown, but if he wins then so be it. If we can't find a stronger candidate in MassaFREAKINGchusetts to oppose him, then that's a deficiency on our part and a note that we need to redouble our efforts.

      Message to Dems: We HAVE to start showing up for Midterms.

      by Jank2112 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:51:25 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  That is it for Obama's second term? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      WilliamE

      How do you figure that?

    •  How about change the law so the special is held (0+ / 0-)

      during the 2014 midterm general election.

      Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

      by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:53:33 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  He will be a good SOS (5+ / 0-)

    I know people are worried about the Senate seat, and it's valid.

    We'll see if Brown even runs. He could probably easily win an open governor's race in 2014 vs. having to win a special senate election and then win another race for the full term a year and half later.

    But if he runs, yes, he will be a strong candidate. But this isnt 2010 either. Obama is in a better political position, and the national party wont fall asleep like they did last time. I have to think we have a better candidate than Coakley.

    •  It's not 2010 for Scott Brown either (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      stephdray

      He was an unknown scrub then. Now he's got statewide name recognition no Dem can match, and virtually all of the people who liked him in 2010 still like him now. He crafted an image for himself that's largely intact.

      Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

      by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:31:01 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Maybe (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        WilliamE

        But he was also the underdog in 2010. He got little to no negative press coverage.

        That changed during his re-election campaign, when he actually had a record to defend. His debate performances werent great and he made some mistakes. Citing Scalia as a judge he admired, for example.

        I'm not doubting that he would be a strong candidate. And I know the electorate wont be like 2012. But an 8 point loss for a supposedly popular incumbent doesnt mean a special election will be easy for him.

        •  8 point loss with (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Zack from the SFV

          the 2012 electorate could easily be a win with a special election electorate. And his press coverage here is largely fawning to this day.

          He's vulnerable on the issues. Now, I think, on gun issues as well. But getting young and urban Democratic voters engaged and to show up will be a huge challenge.

          Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

          by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:26:55 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  He kind of jumped the shark in 2012 (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        sacrelicious, Zack from the SFV

        and he's not hugely popular anymore.  just regular popular.  In 2010, he had more going for him.

        Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

        by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:54:58 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yes and no (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          aseth, Zack from the SFV

          In 2010 he had more going for him in terms of national political mood and crappy opposing campaign. This time he has the benefit of huge statewide recognition (no small factor in special elections) and virtual incumbency.

          He did not jump the shark in 2012. His approval ratings among Democrats and Independents in PPP's last poll before the 2012 election was unchanged from PPP's last poll before the 2010 special election. We just had a well-funded opponent who inspired many volunteers, in a Presidential-year turnout election. And he still got over 46%.

          Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

          by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:06:19 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

  •  If Scott Brown re-enters the Senate... (10+ / 0-)

    ...President Obama deserves all the scorn that will be heaped on him.   John Kerry is a fine man, deserves the post, and will do well in it, but damnit, the Senate is a clusterfuck and every seat counts.

    Fucking unforced errors at every turn from this administration.

    The bear and the rabbit will never agree on how dangerous a dog is.

    by fromer on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:41:54 AM PST

    •  Agreed (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      The Nose, nanorich, aseth

      I'm sure the President has no fucking clue as to why he has to deal with Governor Bonefinger in Arizona these days even though it was his fault in the first place that he needlessly chose their Democratic governor to be in his cabinet at the time.

      Are his only choice sitting office holders?  Is that how thin the Democratic "bench" is?

      •  Arizona was gone to a Republican governor (6+ / 0-)

        in 2010 anyway as Janet Napolitano was going to be term limited out.  It may not have been Jan Brewer but it was going to be some ultra right wing politician.  

        •  And what about 2009 and 2010? (0+ / 0-)

          Had Brewer not been there, the anti-immigrant legislation would not have gone into law.

          Let all the Bush tax cuts expire

          by Paleo on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:58:16 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  It would have once Brewer or some other (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Wee Mama

            right wing politician was elected in 2010.  At the most it would have been delayed for two years and for that matter in those two years the legislation might have become more extreme given Arizona's trends right now.  

          •  Gee, I had no idea Arizona doesn't have (0+ / 0-)

            a legislature, and the Governor enacts and signs legislation all by herself. Do tell.

            •  SB1070 wasn't going into law with Napolitano (0+ / 0-)

              as governor.  Russel Pearce has said so, himself.

              The 2010 was no guarantee as the national climate was quite hostile to Democrats.  Nonetheless, it would have been a lot better had the Democratic candidate been able to campaign as continuing Napolitano's policies.  Instead, Democrats had to run against an incumbent Republican, who had made herself a hero and the election a referendum on immigration issues.

              We don't know what would have happened in the 2010 election had Napolitano stayed.  But we do know what did happen in 2009 and 2010.  Brewer became governor, Arizona passed SB1070, and Brewer went from being an afterthought to one of the most popular Republicans in the state.  

              To believe that markets determine value is to believe that milk comes from plastic bottles. Bromley (1985)

              by sneakers563 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 02:54:21 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

      •  Just listen to yourself (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Jeff Simpson, TLS66, begone, WilliamE

        Some doofus on the internet thinks the President has "no fucking clue" about something.

        Sorry, but I'll take your opinion seriously when you can present public credentials in the same universe as the President's credentials. They don't let clueless people into Harvard Law School, much less let them onto the law review, much less elect them as president of that law review.

    •  Oh Jesus, whatever! (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mspicata, begone

      The same people will be heaping scorn on him NO MATTER WHAT.

      The seat is definitely in play, but this is the best possible moment for the MA Dems, having just organized for the most competitive race there in over 20 years.

      •  Yeah. The same whiners were panicking over (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Jeff Simpson

        Elizabeth Warren's inexperience in campaigning, Kirsten Gillibarnd being a blue dog senator, etc. Guess they're never happy unless finding a glass three fourths full and complaining it's partly empty.

        "A young man who wishes to remain a sound Atheist cannot be too careful of his reading. There are traps everywhere ". C. S. Lewis

        by TofG on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 02:57:21 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  Stupdity and selfishness win out (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ProduceMan, jofr, aseth

    Democrats have met their enemy, and it is themselves.

    Let all the Bush tax cuts expire

    by Paleo on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:43:28 AM PST

  •  I'm not worried about the State Department (11+ / 0-)

    Kerry will do just fine, and he's wanted the job for years.

    I'm worried about this special election.

    To put it bluntly, the Massachusetts Democratic Party does not inspire confidence in their ability to manage an awkward special election without a megastar candidate like Elizabeth Warren who can take care of things independently of the party machinery, and without the benefit of general election turnout.

    This is the party that foolishly changed state law to deny then-Governor Romney appointing powers, on the mere speculation that Kerry might become president, and then even more foolishly attempted to backtrack.

    This is the party that put Martha Coakley up for high office, then spent more time squabbling among themselves than campaigning for her.

    This is the party that is split by sectional conflict between urban machine conservatives and rural clean-government liberals.

    Will they get their act together in time?

    Or will they spoil the strongest national mandate the Democrats have out of the 2012 election -- their thumping Senate election victory -- while handing the Republicans an undeserved gift for their treatment of Susan Rice?

    I'd like to know what Massachusetts posters here think, if my view of the state party is out of date or still all too real.

    •  I think your view of the party is off (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mspicata, decisivemoment

      It's pretty strong. The 2010 Brown election was the only loss we've really had here in a fair number of years. Mass. resisted the 2010 tide in November. Coakley's loss I really put on Coakley.

      The big concern is, with Brown still popular (which he is) and no well-known name to oppose him, it will be hard to win a low-turnout special. Our turnout numbers are remarkably consistent; high (especially among Democrats and most especially in the highly Democratic cities) in Presidential years, less so in midterms, less so still in special elections.

      Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

      by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:36:51 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  So how would the special be timed? (0+ / 0-)

        Knowing Minnesota as I do, a September special would be a high turnout election.  Back to school, and back to the primary.  A July special would be hopeless.  Height of fishing season.

        In Illinois, the other state I'm reasonably familiar with, the key would be to coordinate with local authority elections in April in an odd-numbered year or with the March primary in an even nunbered year.  Of course Illinois law leaves a Senate appointee in until the next general, so we only run into this situation in House elections.  Exhibit A, Jesse Jackson Jr -- and for that one they're going the April route to coordinate with the local elections.  Of course, Illinois being Illinois, nobody talked about turnout.  It was all about saving money for local governments by coordinating the election with elections they're having anyway.

        •  It looks like early summer (0+ / 0-)

          It has to be between 145 and 160 days from the vacancy. If Kerry is confirmed and resigns in January, that means June. If it goes until late January or early February, you're pushing into July.

          The last one, of course, was in January. There was snow north/west of Boston. But turnout for that one wasn't much below the normal turnout in midterm Novembers (e.g. our 2006 and 2010 governor races). I'd expect (gulp) something similar unless we can really drive up the vote something fierce.

          Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

          by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:45:41 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

      •  Then hold the special so it coincides with (0+ / 0-)

        the midterm general election.

        Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

        by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:57:27 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  You can't (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          jofr, Zack from the SFV

          It has to be within 145-160 days of the vacancy. There's no midterm general until November 2014.

          If Hillary would like to stay on until May of 2014 we could do it.

          Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

          by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:02:49 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Change the law again. (0+ / 0-)

            Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

            by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:09:35 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  About as transparent a ploy as ever was (0+ / 0-)

              People here never would go for it.

              Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

              by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 12:25:24 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  I agree. I think the special election law needs (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                fenway49

                to be changed - but AFTER the Kerry SE.  They should look to Hawaii's.  Appointment made by Governor, but from a list given to them by the State Party of the Senator being replaced.  

                So if there is a Repub Senator and a Dem Gov, the Mass GOP would give the Gov a list of 3-5 candidates he'd choose from.  Same for the vice versa.  I think this is the fairest way, and most cost effective.  

                But no way would I support making the change now before the Kerry SE.  That's no different than GOP in Michigan or Ohio or Pa changing electoral college from winner take all to proportional just because they can and it helps them politically.  

                The NRA is the Gun Manufacturer Lobby. Nothing more. Their pontification about the second amendment is nothing more than their ad jingle. They're the domestic version of the Military Industrial Complex.

                by Jacoby Jonze on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 12:48:08 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

    •  Her campaign was not that a juggernaut (0+ / 0-)

      until after labor day.  Before then, griping from some Dem veterans was going on.

      Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

      by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:56:50 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  WHAT OBAMA SAID: (7+ / 0-)

    "If Senator McCain and Senator Graham and others want to go after someone, they should go after me. And I'm happy to have that discussion with them. But for them to go after the United Nations ambassador, who had nothing to do with Benghazi and was simply making a presentation based on intel she had received, and to besmirch her reputation, is outrageous."

    WHAT OBAMA MEANT:
    "If Senator McCain and Senator Graham want to pick my next Secretary of State, all they have to do is say so. And that goes for other Republicans too. They just need to tell me what they want without all the nastiness. I'd rather disappoint Democrats than them any day."

  •  I'd rather have a safe D Senator in Massachusetts (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    mspicata, bartcopfan, aseth

    The flip side is that Elizabeth Warren will be the senior Senator from Mass.

    Some people are intolerant, and I CAN'T STAND people like that. -- Tom Lehrer

    by TheCrank on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:46:03 AM PST

  •  And Scott Brown says: "WooHoo!". n/t (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    The Nose, fenway49, aseth
  •  Menendez also gets Froeign Relations chair... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paleo, fenway49

    Ardent supporter of Cuban Embargo (filibustered something or other because of thawing relations recently) and an ultra hawk supporter of Israel.  

    I know Kerry wanted this gig, but it would have been a bigger sacrifice for the good of the country to stay in the Senate.  

    I do wonder if he could run for Presidency again in 2016.  IF Sec. Clinton doesn't run, I think he might be considering it given he's giving up his Senate seat for life with this appointment (his seat is scheduled up in 2014, meaning it wouldn't be open again until 2020).  He'd be 73 in 2016 - old now, but not historically old to run for President.  

    The NRA is the Gun Manufacturer Lobby. Nothing more. Their pontification about the second amendment is nothing more than their ad jingle. They're the domestic version of the Military Industrial Complex.

    by Jacoby Jonze on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:46:45 AM PST

  •  Congrats to Senator-elect Scott Brown. Now excuse (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paleo

    me while I go slit my wrists.  Seriously, it's almost as if Obama is a GOP sleeper agent designed to destroy the Democrats from within (and, yes, I'm fully aware that that kind of rhetoric sounds akin to something that would have been posted on RedState).

    •  Don't be an ass (8+ / 0-)

      The special election of 2010 was a completely different ball of wax, a fluke.  Brown may be in a good position, but he's hardly won anything yet.  And calling Obama a GOP sleeper agent? You have some nerve.

      "Valerie, why am I getting all these emails calling me a classless boor?"

      by TLS66 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:54:32 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  The hysteria here is getting really weird at times (10+ / 0-)

      Just yesterday I was reading about how Obama had sold his soul to Boner and was getting his pocket picked....now Boner is pealing rubber off his face from where his own party ran him over and Obama's hand is stronger....Kerry, who is probably one of the most qualified people on the planet to be sec of state, gets picked but I am reading it is a disaster for the Democratic party because we have no chance of winning an election in fucking Massachusetts!

      And then there was the crowd that was sure Obama gave away the Presidential election in the first debate....wow, just wow.

      •  Both are true (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        LordMike, singe, docmidwest, sacrelicious

        Obama would have gotten his pocket picked if the House GOP nuts were smart enough to take his offer. As with the 2011 "Grand Bargain" proposal, they saved him from himself.

        Sure, there is a chance Democrats hold the seat, but an equal chance they don't. Just based on who's available to run for each party and the turnout dynamics of special elections. I'll work as hard as needed but I don't kid myself it will be easy if Brown runs.

        Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

        by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:40:06 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  or he took a gamble that they wouldn't go for (0+ / 0-)

          any tax increase under any circumstances---which of course they had all taken an oath about over their mother's graves....and figured he could come out looking more reasonable (which he is) and they more insane giving him more power which i guess it does.

          brown (if he runs and doesn't want to run for governor instead and avoid 4 senate campaigns in what...4 years?) will not be easy to beat but also far from unbeatable and so it goes in politics.

          •  Could be (0+ / 0-)

            I'm not entirely sold. He appointed Simpson and Bowles, two longtime Social Security foes, to come up with a master plan for the federal budget. He offered massive cuts in the 2011 deal. As now, they didn't take that deal, but he offered the cuts. The 2011 deal in particular is too big a risk to take if you're not willing to accept the cuts proposed.

            He's said enough about "reforming" S.S. and Medicare and "folks on the left" having to swallow bitter medicine that I'm skeptical. And he's always been seen are more "reasonable." What good does that do him?

            Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

            by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 12:24:23 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

      •  Obama Derangement Syndrome (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        LaurenMonica, TLS66

        strikes those of both political parties. To hear these people tell it, Obama can't walk and chew gum at the same time. Getting elected twice was just pure dumb luck.

    •  Well, if you want to have a hissy fit (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      TLS66

      about something that can't change the balance of power in the Senate, feel free.

      •  That's just silly (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        docmidwest

        1. If you need 50 votes for a majority, 55 is a lot better than 54. Or have Conservadem defections been outlawed?

        2. 2014. A lot of vulnerable Dem seats up, hardly any vulnerable GOP seats. Holding the Senate will be a challenge unless things break hard Democratic as they did late this cycle. One seat now can make a big difference for 2014.

        Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

        by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 12:44:20 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  The panic on Mass. senate seat is silly. 1) Scotty (0+ / 0-)

          is damaged goods. he'd be smart to wait for gov. race. If not a loss, the probable outcome, should end his political career.
          2) Democrats won't make the same mistake in the special election.

          Just take a deep breath. Also, remember the Democrats, against the odds, added to seats last November. It will be all right.

          "A young man who wishes to remain a sound Atheist cannot be too careful of his reading. There are traps everywhere ". C. S. Lewis

          by TofG on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 02:52:21 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I agree he'd be smart to wait (0+ / 0-)

            for Governor. If he actually feels like doing the work the job entails. And I agree if he loses a Senate election, he's probably done.

            But I don't think he's damaged goods, right now, in any meaningful way. With huge Dem turnout he got over 46%. Historic difference in turnout alone, from a Presidential year to a summer special election, could get him to 50% + 1. Dems won't be asleep at the wheel, but he'll still be the favorite going in.

            Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

            by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 02:59:22 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

  •  Kerry must donate every $$ in his campaign acct (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    fenway49, sacrelicious, docmidwest

    If the Massachusetts special election with a much lower turnout than in the recent election produces a GOP Senate seat win, this will be a huge political blunder by the President.  We'll know in a few months.  Kerry will make a fine Secty of State - as would several others, and the nomination of those others would not put at risk a Senate seat.  I hope the rest of you are still flush with money and can help raise the tens of millions of dollars the Democratic nominee will need in the special election.

    Kerry should show good faith and donate every single dollar in his campaign account to the state Democratic party to help the Democrat in the special Senate election.

  •  Obama to Mass Dems: Drop Dead (7+ / 0-)

    "You fought hard to get rid of Scott Brown?  Well guess what, you're going to have to do it all over again just a few months later.  Bye."

    Let all the Bush tax cuts expire

    by Paleo on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:50:26 AM PST

  •  Stupid move (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paleo, nanorich, aseth

    Risk a Senate seat for Kerry's vanity and Republican blood lust.  Just stupid.

    •  Well, we all know there is no limit (0+ / 0-)

      to Kerry's vanity.

      But it is discouraging that the Democratic bench in Mass,for Chrissakes is so thin....

      •  Here is the problem (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        urovermyknee, LordMike, Swamp Cat

        Mass. Dems are victims of their own success. You had two Senators, Kerry and Kennedy, forever. Thus a whole bunch of Democratic House members re-elected pretty easily every two years, but not well known outside their own districts. No Democrats with real statewide race experience except Gov. Patrick (who won't run for Senate in 2013) and Martha Coakley (been there, done that). Behind them you have a ton of state leg. members, few of whom are known all that well by the public.

        Had Brown not won in 2010, I would expect the Democrats to hold the seat easily in a 2013 special election with a modicum of effort. A Dem like Markey, with experience in Congress and a big war chest, would wipe the floor with one of the state legislature's tiny group of Republicans. But, thanks to Coakley, we have a likely Republican candidate who (1) is known statewide and, in fact, is just coming out of the Senate; (2) has the exact same approval rating among independents in Mass. he had when first elected in 2010.

        Yes, Brown lost in 2012. With a well-funded and famous opponent and huge Dem turnout in a Presidential year. He still got 46%, running well ahead of every other GOP candidate here for federal office except Richard Tisei.

        Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

        by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:47:53 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  No doubt this would be the choice (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    TLS66, wishingwell, LaurenMonica, WilliamE

    After Rice got railroaded...and don't blame Kerry for wanting probably the 2nd best job in government behind the Presidency.  He will do a great job in the role, and I'm sure he will enjoy it.

    As for the special election, if we can't find someone in MA to beat Scott Brown with the way the Republican Party is acting nowadays, we aren't looking.  Brown isn't a Ted Kennedy or even a John Kerry and can be beaten as Liz Warren proved in November.

    Hey you, dont tell me theres no hope at all Together we stand, divided we fall.

    by marcvstraianvs on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:54:28 AM PST

  •  Wow (14+ / 0-)

    What a bunch of pusillanimous flamers. The Democratic party cannot put up a formidable candidate to take down that assclown Brown? Seriously? Howard Dean would like a word with you... Grow a spine, or better coping skills.

    Citizen #6 on Moon Base Callista

    by Mike E on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:55:37 AM PST

    •  Some of these guys (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      LaurenMonica, elmo, WilliamE

      look for ANY excuse to attack the president.  They aren't happy unless they're miserable.

      "Valerie, why am I getting all these emails calling me a classless boor?"

      by TLS66 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:01:16 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Keep calling us names (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Paleo, fenway49, aseth

      We'll see after the special election who was right and sadly I predict it will be us pusillanimous flamers.

      Brown is still very popular in MA.   It isn't like he lost to Warren by double digits or anything and that was during a presidential election.   The make-up of the electorate during this special election will be much more favorable to Brown.

      •  I'd call you a jerk (4+ / 0-)

        if I was into "name-calling"...but what I said I stand by 100%.
        Anything worth attaining is worth fighting for, and you hand-wringing whingers are getting in the way of the battle.

        Better Democrats, please.

        Citizen #6 on Moon Base Callista

        by Mike E on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:15:13 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Do you even live here? (5+ / 0-)

          I knocked on doors in the snow for Martha Coakley (who couldn't be bothered to do the same for herself), and worked all year for Elizabeth Warren. I will do it again. Will you?

          I also damn near got jumped by a bunch of townie goons in Central Mass. because I'll tell it like it is about Scott Brown and the GOP. It's not spineless to assess the situation in my own state, which I know well, and say we have a problem. But I'm sure your happy thoughts will inspire Presidential-level Democratic turnout in a special election.

          BTW, starting a comment by calling people "pusillanimous flamers" is not consistent with not being into name-calling.

          Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

          by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:53:37 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  It's my fault! (0+ / 0-)

            Get serious. Double your efforts. Or, support anyone who will.
            If this wasn't hard, it wouldn't be worth fighting for.

            Citizen #6 on Moon Base Callista

            by Mike E on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:59:33 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  I will triple my efforts (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              docmidwest

              But, frankly, we needed to double or triple our efforts on state and local issues already. And on pushing federal policies. Even if we win it's a lot of energy diverted needlessly.

              Obviously it's not your fault. But you shouldn't piss on the people doing the work here just because they have an opinion.

              Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

              by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:29:09 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

        •  Do you even live here? (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          LordMike, qcsuzie

          I knocked on doors in the snow for Martha Coakley (who couldn't be bothered to do the same for herself). I worked all year for Elizabeth Warren. I'll do it again. Will you?

          I also almost got jumped by a bunch of townie jerks in Central Mass. because I'll tell it how it is about Scott Brown and the GOP. It's not spineless to point out, based on actual knowledge of the state's dynamics, that this will be tough. But I'm sure your happy thoughts magically will generate presidential-year Democratic turnout in a special election.

          BTW, starting a comment by calling people who actually live in the state at issue "pusillanimous flamers" means you are "into name-calling."

          See you in Massachusetts this summer?

          Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

          by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:02:28 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

    •  Nah Its a way to bash the president. Suddently (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Wee Mama, elmo, begone, WilliamE

      Hawk Susan Rice is the hero of the progressive movement and Kerry a wimp. I just cant.

      "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

      by LaurenMonica on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:05:56 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Nothing to see here (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      fenway49

      No senate seat unnecessarily put at risk.  Move on.

      Let all the Bush tax cuts expire

      by Paleo on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:07:43 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Pardon my rant, but... (0+ / 0-)

    ...GODDAMMIT!!  Can our President--who just won a more decisive victory than that POS W ever dreamed of--do anything that isn't what Republican'ts beg him to do?

    [deep breath]

    Yeah, I know JFK's seat is retainable; that Scott Brown isn't that strong a candidate.

    But I saw no reason to withdraw (NotKindaSleazy) Rice from consideration as SoS--that signaled weakness to the R-sharks who crave it and love manufacturing outrage from pure bullshit.

    I know also that this is just another round of eleventy-billion-D chess...but when am I going to get to see a Democrat who recognizes when they win?  Who recognizes that this gains nothing--NOTHING--with conservatives and I personally guarantee it deflates his base.

    [another deep breath]

    Mr. President...you won.  You WON, Sir.  You won.  And Americans love a winner.  I learned my lesson with Bill Clinton that I shouldn't sit down and assume that, once elected, all will be well, but please offer me something/one to fight for.  Please stop attacking your base.

    [deep breath]

    OK, rant over.  Flame away.

    "Push the button, Max!" Jack Lemmon as Professor Fate, The Great Race

    by bartcopfan on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 07:58:47 AM PST

    •  I saw a reason Rice shouldn't have been SoS (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      LaurenMonica, Wee Mama, F J G

      Her her financial ties with Rwandan dictator Paul Kagame are disturbing to say the least.  

      I don't think what Graham and McCain did to her was right but I never wanted her as SoS.  

      Beyond that it was always BOTH Kerry and Rice in the running for the position.

      •  Not forget her ties with Keystone Pipeline. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        F J G

        Environmentalists were already going after her.

        "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

        by LaurenMonica on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:12:53 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Thanks for indulging my rant.... (0+ / 0-)

        I agree, Susan Rice has problems of her own.  I didn't know about the dictator-tie you cite (thanks for that); I'd have refered to apparent ties w/ the Keystone XL pipeline, myself.

        But I loathe handing Republican'ts authority over any Democratic decision and that is the real source of my anger/righteous indignation.

        Thanks again for your indulgence.

        "Push the button, Max!" Jack Lemmon as Professor Fate, The Great Race

        by bartcopfan on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:13:00 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  Big mistake naming the Blowhard to be SOS. I live (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    docmidwest, fenway49, dewley notid

    in MA and we're going to lose his Senate Seat.  Scott Brown is very popular here and there's no real candidate to challenge him if he decides to run.  I can't believe Obama doesn't see this, and I don't care what he thinks he owes Kerry.

  •  Welcome back to the Senate Mr. Brown (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LordMike, fenway49, dewley notid, qcsuzie

    It doesn't take a genius to figure this one out and I don't even need a crystal ball.

    We'll have a Senator Brown again from MA.   People really underestimate the impact of this being a special election vs being held during a Presidential campaign.

    I guess President Obama doesn't really care about possibly losing the Senate in 2014 since he'll be pretty lame after that anyway.

    I guess gays and lesbians shouldn't care that he's probably set to nominate a bigot to head up the Defense Dept. either.

    My disappointment in the political savvy and thoughtfulness of this president remains.   I really thought he might learn something after 4 years on the job, but apparently he hasn't.

    •  No more defeatism (0+ / 0-)

      Relentless defeatism and an outright deification of Brown's chances don't do anything to help win this election.   You do nothing but hurt morale.

      (And BTW:  Hagel has apologized for his 14 year old remark.  I'm not aware of any evidence that he's continued to be disparaging against gay people.  Without that evidence, I don't see these "bigot" allegations as any more warranted than those "anti-Semite" accusations thrown at him for standing up to AIPAC.)

  •  welcome back Senator Brown (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    fenway49

    this should open the door for Scott Brown to return in a special election

    We have no desire to offend you -- unless you are a twit!

    by ScrewySquirrel on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:06:11 AM PST

  •  '60s callback. Hey, hey, NRA. How many kids did (0+ / 0-)

    you kill today?

    "A young man who wishes to remain a sound Atheist cannot be too careful of his reading. There are traps everywhere ". C. S. Lewis

    by TofG on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:08:47 AM PST

  •  BALLS. (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paleo, fenway49, qcsuzie, MAVoter

    I wanted a break, and we have a local election I wanted to focus on.

    Damn you Obama!!!

    PS - it will really suck having TWO very junior Senators from our state, even if we get a Dem elected.

    •  Amen (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      qcsuzie

      Two very junior Senators. Here in Newton we also have local issues and were just discussing how to tackle them. Don't need this.

      Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

      by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:03:47 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  There oughta be a movement (0+ / 0-)

      to move the special so it coincides with the next even year general election.  They do it that way in NY.

      Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

      by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:00:36 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  I agree with you (0+ / 0-)

        going forward. But it's clear the Massachusetts legislature is not willing to change that law in time for this one.

        Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

        by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 12:47:58 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  I remember the accusations of Obama (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LaurenMonica, elmo, TLS66

    being a sell out and an idiot when he didn't name Warren to head the CFPB.  How he caved.  Then lo and behold Warren ran for Senate and she won the seat.  

    Given that history maybe it is worth remembering that we may not know all of the behind the scenes discussions taking place.  

  •  Obama is a fool. We need Kerry in the Senate. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Paleo, According to Fish, qcsuzie
  •  Listen: Brown will win Kerry's seat. Easily. (8+ / 0-)

    I'm a longtime Boston resident and I'm telling you, it won't even be close. This is a terrible idea. We need the Senate seat more than we need Kerry as SoS.

    It'll be a special election--there'll be no Presidential race coattails. All the Brown voters will still be motivated to vote for him again, while it'll be a struggle to bring out enough Dems. And many folks who voted for Warren consider Brown "likeable" and a "good guy" and will be happy to have a chance to give Brown his job back. It'll make these voters feel good.

    It'll be a landslide. What a waste. Frankly I don't give a shit about Kerry's "career" or "ambition." The people of MA hired him for an important job--to represent them for a term as their Senator. Call me old-fashioned or naive (and I'm sure some Kossacks will) but he made a committment to the people of MA that he should keep.

  •  An intense Warren volunteer (6+ / 0-)

    told me he'd consider it a "personal insult" if Obama forced another special election in MA. I have talked with about 10 MA Dems, and every one was completely against this. They aren't sure that Markey or Capuano would lose, but my friends are worn out and not prepared to take on a massively-funded Brown.

    Given that the odds of losing the Senate in 2014 are high already, and that the Supreme Court depends on keeping control, this is an extraordinarily irresponsible decision.

    Armies that make decisions based on personal vanities of generals tend to lose to ones that work strategically.

    Michael Weissman UID 197542

    by docmidwest on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:28:15 AM PST

    •  I volunteered for her and don't it as 'insult' (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Jeff Simpson, zapus, TLS66, redrelic17

      "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

      by LaurenMonica on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:38:52 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  The odds of losing the Senate in 2012 were... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      LaurenMonica

      oh yeah, it was already supposed to have happened!

      Much less chance in 2014.  The Repug bench is full of right wing know-nothings just like the ones they sent up in 2012. They'll make the same kinds of mistakes next time.

      By the way, I'm not in MA, but having Warren AND Obama AND Biden come up and campaign with you should help out whoever is chosen for Senate get some name recognition right quick. They just need to pick someone with fire in the belly and a nose for blood in the water that Brown will provide.

      •  odds, not certainties (0+ / 0-)

        The point is that we don't know things with certainty. There are going to be lots of wins and lots of losses. You don't take a chance on a big loss unless you need to, or there's some big potential payoff.

        Anyway, our generals Obama and Kerry fucked up. Now it's time for us to grit our teeth and fight like hell again, like soldiers everywhere.

        Michael Weissman UID 197542

        by docmidwest on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 11:29:31 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  Thats me... (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      fenway49, aseth

      and my family

      Gave $ and time to get Warren elected and now this bitchslap

      Capuano cannot win a special election where turnout will be very low in the city

      Markey would make a great Sen but it's just not gonna happen in an off year

      Patrick could keep it close but I don't see him running

      •  don't give up (0+ / 0-)

        It's one thing to be really pissed off at the brass but quite another to say the fight is hopeless. At this point, I doubt that would be the Intrade call, though I haven't checked if the market is up yet. We should be able to win in blue MA, since we have perfectly respectable candidates and should have money. It's the volunteers and turnout that are real problems, but not impossible.

        Michael Weissman UID 197542

        by docmidwest on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 03:31:43 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  bitchslap (0+ / 0-)

        Isn't "bitchslap" being a little extreme?

    •  To put it bluntly, Massachusetts Dems have only (0+ / 0-)

      themselves to blame for forcing special elections in situations like this in the first freaking place.  Prior to 2004, the governor had the authority to fill an open Senate seat via appointment, but Massachusetts Democrats didn't want then-Gov. Mittens to appoint a Republican to Kerry's seat if he was elected President.  Thus, we now have this mess, which has now blown up in the Dems' faces TWICE.  Talk about not thinking with long-term vision...

      •  That's because (0+ / 0-)

        there would have been a Republican appointee for four years, until Kerry's term (2002-08 expired. They could have made the appointment good only until the next Congressional election, but that's still two years.

        In 2004 the state was in its 14th consecutive year with a Republican governor. Every reason to expect more Republican governors in the future. Its senators were Kerry and Kennedy. Replacing either with a Republican for any length of time would suck. The law made sense at the time.

        Frankly, it all goes back to Coakley's non-campaign in 2010, a low point for Democrats nationally. She did a poor job, Brown did a good job in running. The 2013 problems I foresee never would have happened without Brown's 2010 win. Don't blame the legislature.

        Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

        by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 12:53:16 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  IINM regardless of Massachusetts law (0+ / 0-)

          There would have been a special election in 2006 due to federal law.

          At least such is my understanding.

          Registered in NY-02, College CT-01, Spent most of the rest of my life on the border of NY-08 and NY-15

          by R30A on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 06:28:48 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I don't believe so (0+ / 0-)

            How vacancies are filled is determined by state law. In Mass. prior to the 2004 change, the governor appointed someone to finish the term, however long it was scheduled to run. It didn't matter if an intervening federal election was held (or even two).

            Some states call for a quick special election (like Mass. now), others call for an appointment until the next Congressional election. That way the appointee gets two years max but there's no special election at an off-season since they tend to have funky results. See Brown, Scott.

            Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

            by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 06:48:07 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

    •  personal (0+ / 0-)

      It's not a good idea to take political decisions "personally".  

      Someone else pointed out that the odds of losing the Senate in 2012 were also high.

      •  Russian roulette (0+ / 0-)

        Sure, your point about "personal" is right, but you need volunteers to win and they are persons.

        On your other point, that's deeply flawed reasoning. It's almost a textbook illustration of how Nate Silver says the "fish" think in poker. You just know you're on that streak.

        Michael Weissman UID 197542

        by docmidwest on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 06:00:57 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

  •  Say hello to Senator-Elect Brown (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LordMike, fenway49

    Blaaaaa. When Obama is in office instead of campaigning he seems to lose his ability for political calculation.

    Granted, I could be totally wrong, in fact I hope I am, but im doubting it.

    Prohibition makes crimes out of things that are not crimes - Abraham Lincoln

    by Unseen majority on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:39:39 AM PST

  •  I think my early New Years Resolution will be ... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    zapus, WilliamE

    ... to avoid any discussion of the upcoming Senate election in Massachusetts.  While I certainly appreciate everyone's opinions and their right to voice them, this is really starting to get polarizing and nasty, and in my opinion unnecessarily so.  I think we should all channel this energy and passion into getting behind the best Democrat we can find to hold this seat.

  •  I support the appointment (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Minnesota Mike

    I thiink J Kerry is the right person for the office if H Clinton continues not. He is going to a higher level office that deserves the strongest possible choice.

    Looking at the senate seat, as habitually I'm a little more optimistic than the averages.

    From the previous polls I see at least two persons that can defeat S Brown again. One is D Patrick. The other is a Kennedy. Until now J Kennedy II, but I would not rule out J Kennedy III and the young T Kennedy can tie him.

    Now it is question of doing a good recruitment. I would not like to see running someone who begins back M Coakley in the polls because that mean is a candidate who need to build a necessary strength in order to win the race.

    I was thinking he was beatable all the last cycle. Now I think it with stronger reasons.

    •  The office deserves a high level appointment (0+ / 0-)

      And the appointed person deserves the appointment.

      I think all is right until here.

      Im not the most risk lover at the time of finding candidates. I habitually want the strongest people running. But I understand this time the importance of the office.

      Now it is time of finding the strongest candidate. The polls must work now, so fast. And I hope the Democratic frontrunner runs and wins.

      S Brown is beatable. I doubt this time he will have the same money. The Republicans have still higher risk than the Democrats in a state like Massachussetts. And they failed big the las cycle selecting their goals. They burn tons of money in races like MA-Sen 2012. We will see if they want again to repeat this big mistake.

      I think the local people will appreciate the step of Obama appointing one of their guys. Im positive about the chance of keeping the seat.

  •  today's poll shows GOP's Brown beating all Dems (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    LordMike, urovermyknee, aseth

    in the upcoming Special election for Kerry's Senate seat by 17 - 19%.  WBUR poll out of Boston, per politicalwire.com.   Republican Scott Brown's favorability rating is a positive 58% favorable to 28% unfavorable.  Poll tested GOP's Brown against Democrats Markey, Meehan, Capuano and Lynch.

    I assume Obama's pollsters looked at their own Massachusetts numbers and warned Obama of the risk that the Senate seat may well be lost to the Republicans.  

    •  Coakley was a prohibitive favorite (0+ / 0-)

      when the race for Ted Kennedy's seat began in August, 2009.  You know, I live in NYC.  Our mayor, Bloomberg, was not expected to win his initial race, even with his billions.  Mark Green was 40 points ahead.  I guess the point I'm making is, it's ain't over til it's over.  Was it over when the German bombed Pearl Harbor? God, some of you people attacking the president make me physically sick.

      "Valerie, why am I getting all these emails calling me a classless boor?"

      by TLS66 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 09:22:22 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Bloomberg won because of 9/11 (0+ / 0-)

        Brown won't mail it in like Coakley did. The point is understood but not really pertinent. Can Brown be beaten? Yes. Will it be easy in a low-turnout special election? Not at all. Do we like having to go do this again? No, not really.

        Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

        by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 12:55:05 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Well (0+ / 0-)

          Are you going to give up because you don't like having to go do this again?  I really hope the answer is "no'.

          •  Oh, I'll work hard but shouldn't have to (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            docmidwest

            Lovely how people ignore all the actual analysis from people who live in Mass. and pretend that's my argument.

            My real concern is that I think it pretty likely we'll lose the seat. And for a long time. To a jerk we just busted our tails to get rid of. If Brown runs and loses, a Dem incumbent should be OK when the seat's up again in Nov. 2014. Brown should be finished as a major contender. Great. But if Brown wins, which is a pretty good chance, then he's all set for re-election in a midterm.  

            People seem to think his 46% this year is a new ceiling for him. I'd say it's more like his floor. In a huge turnout Presidential year, with unforced errors by his campaign and an army of volunteers against him, he got over 46%.

            Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

            by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 05:41:31 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

  •  First, do no harm. (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    qcsuzie, fenway49, aseth

    This does harm. I've got no problem with Kerry as SOS, in a vacuum where it doesn't hurt the party in the Senate. In the real world, I've got a big problem with it. Will Kerry be that much better at SoS than whomever the next name on the list would have been to really make it worth putting that seat at risk and giving the media an early chance to play "referendum on Obama" ahead of the VA and NJ 2013 "referendums on Obama?"

    Dumb. Just dumb.

  •  John McCain played us (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    qcsuzie, fenway49, aseth

    He went after Rice because he knew Kerry was next in line which would open his senate seat that Scott Brown will have no problem winning back.  Dumb, unforced error by dems.  Brown is a young guy so he could have that seat for a very long time.

  •  What a bunch of freaking crybabies... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    TLS66, Inkan1969

    This is the Secretary of State, folks, a pretty vital position in any administration. John Kerry is the best qualified person for that position, which is why Obama has tapped him for the job. If the Democrats can't win a Senate race in fucking Massachusetts, especially after the lessons learned from the Coakley debacle, that's hardly the President's fault.

  •  can a pro-life Dem beat GOP's Scott Brown? (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    qcsuzie

    Pro-life Democratic Congressman Steve Lynch, one of the favorites of labor unions, appears to be signaling he will run in the special election to replace John Kerry and thinks he can win in a crowded field, even though he is pro-life.  Does anyone here think that a pro-life Democratic nominee will be able to raise the tens of millions in small dollar contributions, will be able to excite the base of volunteers needed for get-out-the-vote efforts and will be able to motivate the legions of pro-choice Democratic women in Massachusetts to vote for him?

    I don't.

    If Massachusetts Dems nominate a pro-life candidate for the special Senate election, I fear the GOP's Brown would win it in a walk.

  •  Excited that we'll have a SoS that speaks a (0+ / 0-)

    foreign language fluently. It's embarrassing that many of our SoS can only speak English.

    President Obama at Madison Rally 9/28/2010 - "Change is not a spectator sport."

    by askew on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:03:04 AM PST

  •  Guys, we don't even know if Brown will fun for Sen (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    David Jarman, MAVoter, NMLib

    Consider this: He ran in a 2010 special, the 2012 general.  And if he runs again, he'll have to run in a 2013 Special (under current law) and a 2014 general (if he wins the special, G-d forbid).  It's easier to run for Governor in 2014.

    That said, they should move the special to coincide with the next even year general election like they do in NY.

    Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

    by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:03:27 AM PST

    •  *run (0+ / 0-)

      Age 23. Voting in NJ-03. Lived most of life in NJ-01. Had Rush Holt represent me during my undergrad years and am now represented by Frank Pallone in my grad school.

      by KingofSpades on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:16:11 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  They should change the special election rule after (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      fenway49, LordMike

      the Kerry seat opening is filled via SE.  Enough playing with that rule to serve partisan politics.  Dems playing with that one to control the Senate seat is no different than GOP in Michigan, Ohio or PA changing electoral college to game the system for their benefit.  

      I like the Hawaii rules where the replacement has to be from the same party and the State party gets to give Gov a list of 3-5 candidates he can then choose from.  

      The NRA is the Gun Manufacturer Lobby. Nothing more. Their pontification about the second amendment is nothing more than their ad jingle. They're the domestic version of the Military Industrial Complex.

      by Jacoby Jonze on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:20:43 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  I Agree, (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      KingofSpades

      I'm tired of hearing that Mass Dems are suddenly bound to handing the Senate seat back over to Brown. I don't think Brown is enticed to run four Senate races in five years, and while I don't fully agree he would be a "shoo-in" for Governor in 2014 I think he would much rather run for that. Moreover, while the bench in MA isn't spectacular, Ed Markey, Mike Capuano, Carmen Ortiz, Ted Kennedy Jr., and even Martha Coakley are all formidable candidates who have their pros and cons just like any other candidate. Brown just lost (BY EIGHT POINTS), Juggernauts don't lose. He is not invincible.

  •  Such negativitiy (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    TLS66

    What if Ted Kennedy Jr. runs

    http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/...

  •  A lackluster choice, and again he is played (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    qcsuzie

    President Obama has so many extraordinary attributes, but alas, as a political player on Capital Hill he is ever so very easily played.  The GOP wanted Scott Brown back in the Senate and demonized Ambassador Susan Rice to achieve that end.  

    The GOP wanted every conceivable concession, even the unprecedented dismantling of the Social Safety Net, and before this so-called "fiscal cliff" deal is completed, they will likely have received not just the whole house in the bet but also all the surrounding grounds besides.

    And of course Republican Senator Chuck Hegel--however moderate as compared to the now gleefully right-wingTea Partiers controlling todays's GOP--will be selected as Defense Secretary.

    Was this general election ever a true victory for the Democratic Party?  One has to wonder.  If after an electoral and political triumph for progressive forces on November 6, we are this early witnessing such a depressing twist toward an emboldened GOP, whither shall progesssives find themselves in the coming months and years?

    I consider myself fortunate that I have never ascribed to that bizarre purple muddle that is now President Obama's signature national and even world view.

  •  How can Kerry stand up to repressive Islamic (0+ / 0-)

    regimes that pass fundamentalist Islamic beliefs into laws when he broke with the WH and said that schools and hospitals shouldn't have to provide contraception coverage if it goes against their religious beliefs?

    The NRA is the Gun Manufacturer Lobby. Nothing more. Their pontification about the second amendment is nothing more than their ad jingle. They're the domestic version of the Military Industrial Complex.

    by Jacoby Jonze on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 10:45:21 AM PST

  •  Kennedy Jr is gonna be the next (0+ / 0-)

    senator from Massachusetts.  Brown is not gonna beat him.  I think the Dems will get behind K Jr 100% and make sure of that.

    •  Sure (0+ / 0-)

      The guy who lives in Connecticut. That's not going to arouse any of the anti-Kennedy backlash or anything.

      Republicans...think the American standard of living is a fine thing--so long as it doesn't spread to all the people. And they admire the Government of the United States so much that they would like to buy it. Harry S. Truman

      by fenway49 on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 12:58:26 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  Why?? Why?? Why?? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    fenway49, urovermyknee

    I can not believe the Obama fell for the Republican Senators' tricks.  Anyone seasoned in politics should have been able to see that the Republican opposition to Susan Rice was not over the Benghazi situation, but a way to get their best buddy Scott Brown back into the Senate.

    Anyone not living in Massachusetts does not realize that Obama justhanded the Senate seat on a silver platter to good ole boy Republican Scotty Brown.

    Scotty has been aching for Kerry's appointment, so he can run once again and be back in the senate.  He still has a huge war chest and a ground game that is years ahead of any potential democratic candidate.

    As a Massachusetts voter, I am personally upset at this appointment.  

    I wish I could get a refund on all the dollars and time I put into the Obama campaign.  My President has truly let me down.

  •  Why din't Reid (0+ / 0-)

    or Patty Murray call Obama and tell him that this is a big mistake?

    The effort needed to keep this blue boggles my mind.

  •  Apart (0+ / 0-)

    Apart from the numbers game, this just seems like such a downgrade for the office.  I don't dislike Kerry, but he probably wouldn't have even been among my top five picks.  State's become an office you want to put some starpower/celebrity into, or at the least an office in whcih you want someone with loads of charisma since it's the face of the United States to the world.  I guess he's more than capable, but along with the kind of pitiful angling for a cabinet spot for years, now, and him being a losing presidential candidate, all I can muster is a "meh."

    •  I don't know - diplomats don't need to be (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      NMLib, askew

      charismatic.   I mean name me a charismatic SoS - Clinton, Condi, Powell, Christopher, Baker...  Hillary had some star power and gravitas, but Kerry got 60M votes in 2004, Hillary lost the primary in 2008.

      What Kerry has is established relationships with a lot of the key players - there will be a certain level of trust with him.  Kerry is more credentialed than Sec. Clinton was in '08.  

      The NRA is the Gun Manufacturer Lobby. Nothing more. Their pontification about the second amendment is nothing more than their ad jingle. They're the domestic version of the Military Industrial Complex.

      by Jacoby Jonze on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 06:08:58 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

  •  I find some mindsets here remarkable (5+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    KingofSpades, askew, redrelic17, NMLib, R30A

    Regarding the "risk" of losing the seat, setting aside for the moment I've been adamant and still am that we're not going to lose the seat to Brown or anyone else, it's amazing to me that people here have the tunnel vision to insist Obama's pick for Secretary of State should be dictated by electoral gamesmanship.

    Obama is elected to govern, not constantly look ahead to another election.  He wants Kerry on the merits as his top choice (I realize really the second choice after Rice but with her out, Kerry is the top one now).  He wouldn't be doing his job to pass on Kerry because of how a special election for his seat might go.  If Democrats can't hold a U.S. Senate seat in Massachusetts, that's the exclusive fault of the Democratic candidate and the Democratic Party.

    It's not a permanent campaign.  President Obama refuses to pretend it is.

    44, male, Indian-American, married and proud father of a girl and 2 boys, Democrat, VA-10

    by DCCyclone on Fri Dec 21, 2012 at 08:34:34 PM PST

    •  Yes. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      R30A

       I was amused when one poster mentioned how "exhausted" Massachusetts Democrats where after their energy expenditure in beating Scott Brown. Are MA Dems aware that in some other states there can be as many as 4 or 5 viable Republicans ready to run a statewide campaign? And that maybe some other states have to deal with more conservative electorates? This mindset that Democratic campaigns in Massachusetts need such hand-holding has really shed some light on how Coakley lost in the first place.

      http://www.snappac.org/ Students for a New American Politics!

      by redrelic17 on Sat Dec 22, 2012 at 02:50:44 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Then why does he campaign for Dem candidates? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      MetroGnome

      And raise money for them?

      He's the head of the Democratic party and that's what he should be doing.  For the same reason, he should not be putting Democratic seats in jeopardy just so he can have a "name" in his cabinet.  This is not 1865.

      Let all the Bush tax cuts expire

      by Paleo on Sat Dec 22, 2012 at 02:34:24 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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